Possibly Helpful Advice

Including what we found in Scientology before it became a cult

Reforming the Church of Scientology – is it possible?

There is a new website called savescientology.com which has the clearest explanation of the corporate structure of the Church of Scientology I have seen. This site reveals the interconnection of the three elements of the current COS which are: CST, CSI and RTC using this high level diagram:

It discusses LRH intention for the church using LRH references and it discusses the CURRENT scene in the church using Internet and publicly available references.

This site draws a fascinating parallel between the actions of Pope Leo X and David Miscavige. Pope Leo X presided over the splintering of the church into what would become a thousand pieces, what history refers to as The Reformation.

Every staff member and independent scientologist should read this material and judge for themselves whether the COS can be reformed or not.

I strongly support the efforts of this Save Scientology site to publicize the current state of the COS, but I respectfully disagree with their hopeful and idealistic conclusions.

Here is my recent comment:

Nice work on making the relationships between CST, RTC, and CSI clear.

The information has existed on the Internet for some time, but you have organized it in a way that can be easily comprehended. Excellent work with the colored highlighting, by the way.

Putting this information out in this manner allows all Scientologists to see what is going on and draw their own conclusions. I consider that you have achieved what you set out in your Mission Statement:

“To Inform the Scientology community about LRH’s intentions when he established the corporate and governing structure of Scientology organizations shortly before his departure and during the process of writing up and turning over his hats, and to expose the fact that safeguards put in place by LRH have been unmocked, his intentions betrayed and dishonored.”

Here is where we draw different conclusions:

Like Leo X, David Miscavige  refuses to acknowledge the unethical situations in which his church was involved.  Indeed, Miscavige is too arrogant and all-powerful to entertain any sort of criticism from mere staff and  parishioners. Like Leo X, David Miscavige has so thoroughly cowed the executives in the Church of Scientology, that reform from within is highly unlikely while Miscavige retains any scrap of influence in the church.

The independent groups that practice standard Scientology will not meekly be put back under control of a church that violates human rights at every turn and turns a blind eye to the excesses and wrongdoings of its management.

When the church of Scientology has been corrected by the US government and other governments with the result that Miscavige and his cohorts are in jail or have fled to Venezuela, then there is a slight possibility that some loyal staff members will have a chance to actually reform the COS.

At that point, the independent Scientologists in the field may consider granting an amnesty to the Church of Scientology an allow it to co-exist with the independent field.

One of the conditions will probably be the complete dissolution of the paramilitary organization known as the Sea Org.

The more likely situation is that beings going free outside the church will never agree to re-experience the cult mindset and will expand independent services in all directions from here on out.

Best regards,

David St Lawrence
Grad V, OT7
Delivering auditing for 23 years

Number of views:2267


Robin Scott Cl IV Clear OT  on February 20th, 2011

Thanks, David – outstanding analysis, my friend. I understand and respect your stance on this issue.
They may be genuine but, as you suggest, naive and idealistic – in which case they should be willing to take challenging questions.
Or they may be stooges for IRS/OSA – in which case that will soon become apparent.
I did point out to them in the post they scrubbed that the vast majority of former Scientologists don’t want anything to do with ever again!
The only point where I disagree with you is on the Sea Org – but I’m not going to argue with you about that, as it’s entirely academic at this stage!
Many thanks and warmest regards, Robin

OldAuditor  on February 20th, 2011

Thanks Robin,

You illustrate my point perfectly as we may all have differing opinions on the continuing utility of the Sea Org or other vestiges of the current COS.

I received a response from the Save Scientology site admin which is worth repeating here:

admin says:
February 20, 2011 at 6:26 pm

You may be right. It might be too late to mend the rift. Obviously, you have some hard feelings. Others do, too. On both sides. But the tech can do wonders, so we haven’t given up. For the independent movement to work, and the tech to remain standard, it must have a strong central org. Do you agree on that?

David St Lawrence says:

Thanks for your prompt response. Actually, I handled my hard feelings by coming to terms with the fact that I had ignored the danger signs for at least 15 years. I came up through the conditions while writing my possibly helpful advice blog and helping others to recover from their church experiences.

The tech can do wonders, and I prove that almost every day to the satisfaction of my preclears. Do not give up in your endeavors.

As for your comment: “For the independent movement to work, and the tech to remain standard, it must have a strong central org.” I say absolutely not!

Having spent 55 years in high tech corporations, I have certainty that open source is not the spawn of the devil as it takes advantage of the shared experiences of people who have actually USED technology to improve it. :)

A top-down organization cannot compete with a distributed intelligence as is found on the internet today. I am encouraging practitioners to fill in the gaps in Miscavige technology by submitting articles to the Workable Technology Forum: /simplemachinesforum/

This is just one of many efforts to create workable technology out of the chaos that Miscavige has created. There will be more.

Thank you for what you are doing.


Robin Scott Cl IV Clear OT  on February 20th, 2011

Excellent, David!
Have you posted your reply on their website, by the way?
warmest regards, Robin

David says: Yes, That was why I duplicated it here.

lunamoth  on February 21st, 2011

Thank you, David! I agree with you on all points, particularly the point about the sea org. I also believe that until those promoting the reform of the church are able to view the independent field as it is, without any bias whatsoever, they will hold to the idea of the necessity of a strong central org. Unfortunate in my opinion as I believe that preserving that structure and its authority over the tech and over individuals will inevitably lead to this very same point in the future.

As LRH himself once said about revolution (and I paraphrase heavily here),the government you get when you throw the scoundrels out is just a different group of scoundrels.

There is a bloodless revolution going on within the group of people calling themselves scientologists, and the truly revolutionary thing about it is that those on the outside no longer accept the necessity or even the desirability of governance by an institution in the area of their personal spirituality or it’s practice. Those choosing to remain within the sphere of such governance will just have to deal with that, because it’s not going to go away. It is the direction of the greatest personal freedom, and forwarded as it is by the existence of the internet, its attraction to others is only going to grow.

AnonLover  on February 22nd, 2011

Excellent post – I too am impressed with the savescientology.com in relation to the corporation dox that have published over there.

I’ve been studying that stuff on and off lately after Anons released a big batch of public records gotten under California FOIA laws.

I’ve been meaning to compare what savescientology.com has a copy if to vs. what was recently gotten from the Cali Secretary of State’s office, to see if there was any discrepancies that might reveal something not readily apparent in the public records themselves.

But alas, I havent gotten around to finishing that comparison yet. Once I did it get done, I was planning on trying to find the means to fwd the public records Anons got to the webmaster along with my findings for their benefit since Anons have no real use for the info we obtained at this time.

No reason for good dox to go waste, and since I have gotten a chance to finish my study on this stuff – here’s a link to the public records gotten on RTC & CST that have been released into the public domain:


If someone could fwd this link to appropriate person(s) at savescientology.com – please relay word they are free to do whatever they wish with the dox.

If any of this stuff is deemed useful – please have someone send me a headsup on ESMB via PMs or replying to this comment here if by chance any of those public record dox get added to the website, so that I know to go look & properly admire the webmaster’s handiwork :)

Marta  on February 23rd, 2011

“The more likely situation is that beings going free outside the church will never agree to re-experience the cult mindset and will expand independent services in all directions from here on out.”

Thank you, David. I’m on the same page with you in your post and especially the statement above. I am on high alert for cult-mind patterns and reactions that were laid in within the CofS. My taste buds are very attuned to the taste of brine in the waters, so to speak.

You are excellent with analysis and communicating clearly and fairly. I very much appreciate you and your work to help this movement away frommwhat has been for way too long.

Robin Scott Cl IV Clear OT  on February 23rd, 2011

Just reviewing, David, noticed their Admin’s comment that there were hard feelings on both sides!
So, what are they so upset about? The fact that we resigned and went away? Their whole tone is too defensive.
I note they haven’t got back to you since.
Warmest regards, Robin

Rusty Champion  on April 14th, 2011

The idea that the Independent Scientology Movement would ‘need’, or even,’agree’ to the central Org. concept, is at best naive, and at worst completely out of touch with the magnitude of the Squirrelling and criminality that has gone on in the Church, ‘un-checked’, for the past 26 years. I support the savescientology.com web site, not because i have ANY intentions of returning to the Church, “NOT”…. But because of the facts listed on the site, finally the Truth is being published by members in good standing, the same truth the Independent’s have been publishing for years, and being attacked for.
Kudos to the site!
Rusty Champion

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